Declan Rice: Cooking Again

[db10_therza]

Back to Declan - he has to play at 6 next game against Bayern. Or we have to start Partey over Jorginho.

He knew that Jorginho would not have the legs to cover their ridiculously fast counter attacks and spent the entire game walking a tightrope between staying back to cover and going forwards to help and almost tripped over it a few times.

When you add in that our most ponderous defender was attempting to cover Leroy Sane, in hindsight this was a pretty large miscalculation.

Partey + Rice as double pivot gets my vote for the return leg.

Longer term - said it before and I’ll say it again. Buying a proper left 8 is the single most important signing for this summer by far, and the lack of strong links here has me a bit worried icl.

Rice at 6 is world class off the ball. There is no 2 ways about it, the guy is a cheat code. So yes, build your team around that. Give him creative outlets around him to pass it off to and let him cook.

 

[RunTheTrap]

Back to Declan - he has to play at 6 next game against Bayern. Or we have to start Partey over Jorginho.

He knew that Jorginho would not have the legs to cover their ridiculously fast counter attacks and spent the entire game walking a tightrope between staying back to cover and going forwards to help and almost tripped over it a few times.

When you add in that our most ponderous defender was attempting to cover Leroy Sane, in hindsight this was a pretty large miscalculation.

Partey + Rice as double pivot gets my vote for the return leg.

Longer term - said it before and I’ll say it again. Buying a proper left 8 is the single most important signing for this summer by far, and the lack of strong links here has me a bit worried icl.

Rice at 6 is world class off the ball. There is no 2 ways about it, the guy is a cheat code. So yes, build your team around that. Give him creative outlets around him to pass it off to and let him cook.

In general, the left-hand side is the most volatile area of the pitch. Can anyone here tell me who will be our starting left winger, left eight and left-back for next season? Compare that to our right-hand side: Saka, Ødegaard and White.

We have had a nice upturn of form since our trip to Dubai, but we've been playing at 80% of our potential. The new midfielder has to be the best foil for Rice and Ødegaard. But someone who can connect the dots with our left side.

 

[db10_therza]

The new midfielder has to be the best foil for Rice and Ødegaard. But someone who can connect the dots with our left side.

 

[Macho]

In general, the left-hand side is the most volatile area of the pitch. Can anyone here tell me who will be our starting left winger, left eight and left-back for next season? Compare that to our right-hand side: Saka, Ødegaard and White.

We have had a nice upturn of form since our trip to Dubai, but we've been playing at 80% of our potential. The new midfielder has to be the best foil for Rice and Ødegaard. But someone who can connect the dots with our left side.

Never know with Arteta nobody is safe. I personally never saw ESR or Ramsdale coming and I wasn’t even crazy about either of them.

If there’s even a marginal upgrade, or like another Saka out there with the exact same output minus the limping - Arteta would break the bank and do it he dgaf.

Still not clear to me who Timber was supposed to compete with.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

Never know with Arteta nobody is safe. I personally never saw ESR or Ramsdale coming and I wasn’t even crazy about either of them.

If there’s even a marginal upgrade, or like another Saka out there with the exact same output minus the limping - Arteta would break the bank and do it he dgaf.

Still not clear to me who Timber was supposed to compete with.

Don't think Arteta sees it this way, not even trolling.

Think he considers players and squads like swiss army knives, can X player do Y job in Z situation, and Timber can do things our other players arguably couldn't do so he was signed to fill those roles in the squad.

 

[Batman]

Don't think Arteta sees it this way, not even trolling.

Think he considers players and squads like swiss army knives, can X player do Y job in Z situation, and Timber can do things our other players arguably couldn't do so he was signed to fill those roles in the squad.

Timber in particular I think was signed to give us the option to invert both fullbacks, rest Saliba or White and also compensate for the dependence on Zinchenko inverting to our build up and final third actions. When Zinchenko was injured and he was able to lock down LB, I think we would have seen him as the main left back this season.

I believe Arteta was fine with him either winning one of the fullback jobs or just being the swiss army knife you mentioned that allowed us to play different formations or create different actions based upon which role he occupied and also to not be an extreme drop off in quality to anyone in the back 4. I could even have seen him playing DM at times with Rice at 6 or sitting in a double pivot with Rice in Partey's absence. He's also more of a ball carrier than White is at RB and certainly more than anyone at LB so that could have opened up some options for Saka and Ødegaard as well, particularly in the transitional phases.

 

[Big Poppa]

In general, the left-hand side is the most volatile area of the pitch. Can anyone here tell me who will be our starting left winger, left eight and left-back for next season? Compare that to our right-hand side: Saka, Ødegaard and White.

We have had a nice upturn of form since our trip to Dubai, but we've been playing at 80% of our potential. The new midfielder has to be the best foil for Rice and Ødegaard. But someone who can connect the dots with our left side.

 

[Riou]

His best game in Europe was Sevilla away, he played that as an 8 and was outstanding.

Think it was the yellow, really seemed to play in his mind...the way he lost track of his man for the first goal showed he wasn't as tuned in as normal, thought he was the reason we couldn't get Gabby into the game at all too (Declan didn't really show for the ball enough for me)

Top player still, whether an 6 or 8...rare bad game doesn't change that.

 

[Geofranco]

This is spot on.

Kante is the GOAT. Guy just made teams win trophies end of. Hypothetically if he were to be at the base of midfield of say a fantasy AM euros draft team and that team didn’t end up winning the whole thing I would say the game was rigged, wouldn’t you @Rex Stone ?

Kante was like the Bill Russell of football. The ultimate winner

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

He needs to start at 6 in Munich.

I love Jorgi but you're asking for trouble with him there against the pace of Bayern on the break. He just doesn't have the legs for it against that sort of opposition.

 

[TheEliteMaster100_]

Look at Rice in this passing network in the first half compared to 2nd half when he went to a lone 6 and Zinny holding his hand in build up


Henry analysis on Rice playing a part in Bayern 1st goal (Gnabry)

 

[db10_therza]

Henry analysis on Rice playing a part in Bayern 1st goal (Gnabry)

Rice’s off the ball anticipation is pretty much the best part of his game and I’d be interested to know if you can name a single player in world football that matches him in this aspect. It’s wild to me that people would jump on this aspect of his game for the one time where it falters.

It’d be like people jumping on Haaland’s finishing coz he’s missed a few this season. It’s just dumb.

Agree with the point about distribution but this is pretty known at this point.

The issues with our midfield (esp in first half) vs Bayern were more tactical than personnel for me.

 

[Macho]

Rice’s off the ball anticipation is pretty much the best part of his game and I’d be interested to know if you can name a single player in world football that matches him in this aspect. It’s wild to me that people would jump on this aspect of his game for the one time where it falters.

It’d be like people jumping on Haaland’s finishing coz he’s missed a few this season. It’s just dumb.

Agree with the point about distribution but this is pretty known at this point.

The issues with our midfield (esp in first half) vs Bayern were more tactical than personnel for me.

I really liked Henry's analysis though, he is completely right the dregs we usually face in the league nothing would come from that scenario.

Even Liverpool fluffed the 5v1 scenario against a solo Rice, those Bayern fowards are killers but we get too caught up in our little darlings and gloss over that bit.

 

[Dokaka]

Rice’s off the ball anticipation is pretty much the best part of his game and I’d be interested to know if you can name a single player in world football that matches him in this aspect. It’s wild to me that people would jump on this aspect of his game for the one time where it falters.

It’d be like people jumping on Haaland’s finishing coz he’s missed a few this season. It’s just dumb.

It's a general problem with modern football. There is a hard ceiling on how a modern player can be perceived vs. former greats because everything is captured on video and shared. You can take the best CBs in the world and tear them apart despite making 2-3 mistakes across 2000 minutes of football and they're seen as inferior to guys like Vidic, Campbell etc.

Just reading stuff on here you'd think someone like Vieira never misplaced a pass or lost a man in his life, which is obviously not true.

 

[MutableEarth]

Look at Rice in this passing network in the first half compared to 2nd half when he went to a lone 6 and Zinny holding his hand in build up


Henry analysis on Rice playing a part in Bayern 1st goal (Gnabry)

The key is the quality we were against. Forget league form, these guys are experienced campaigners at this level and in this competition compared to us. Henry is right that perhaps in the PL we won't get punished nearly as readily as we did in this game. The margins are much finer. Me personally, I actually liked how we were able to withstand and get back into the game, it shows we've still got something to offer at this end. Think we shouldn't be scared.

 

[OnlyOne]

I was a big fan of saying Rice could play 8 and while he’s done well I think it should be just for this season, he needs to move back to 6 and we should get a proper 8.

 

[db10_therza]

I really liked Henry's analysis though, he is completely right the dregs we usually face in the league nothing would come from that scenario.

Even Liverpool fluffed the 5v1 scenario against a solo Rice, those Bayern fowards are killers but we get too caught up in our little darlings and miss that bit.

Yeah this is fair esp in terms of this specific play. It’s just weird to me though that you wouldn’t also highlight the fact that Rice is generally elite at anticipation and that this was basically an isolated incident as far as his track record is concerned.

Anticipation in general is such an underrated and misunderstood concept in football and that’s probably why I got my back up about it.

I used to have the exact same arguments with Arsenal fans about Gilberto Silva and it brings back bad memories.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

It's a general problem with modern football. There is a hard ceiling on how a modern player can be perceived vs. former greats because everything is captured on video and shared. You can take the best CBs in the world and tear them apart despite making 2-3 mistakes across 2000 minutes of football and they're seen as inferior to guys like Vidic, Campbell etc.

Just reading stuff on here you'd think someone like Vieira never misplaced a pass or lost a man in his life, which is obviously not true.

It's a nostalgia thing isn't it.

When you look back on great players you remember them at their peak and their moments of magic not their mean or off days

No-one is looking back at highlight reels off Henry or DB10 missing sitters or Gilberto making a poor DM mistake, and they all did that and had games where they weren't up to par.

Rice doesn't belong in these guys bracket of course, but he had one poor-ish game ( and part of that was tactical) and people want to rip his game apart or use it as evidence that he's not that good. Even though for 95% of the season he's been excellent

 

[Riou]

If Rice was just playing well against the lesser sides then I would have a go at him, but he's been one of our best players this season in wins against City and Liverpool ffs...v City away he was excellent positionally for us, even for England he's been great in big Euros and World Cup games the last teo tournaments

It's just a bad game, it's fine as it happens to everyone.

 

[db10_therza]

I was a big fan of saying Rice could play 8 and while he’s done well I think it should be just for this season, he needs to move back to 6 and we should get a proper 8.

I think this is where your point is really valid @Macho wrt the quality of our normal opponents vs CL quality in Bayern.

Rice simply cannot play at 8 vs this level of opposition.